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Very Hot Topic (More than 100 Replies) Tahr eradication proposed by the minister (Read 15146 times)
gonehuntin
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #255 - Oct 11th, 2018 at 6:30pm
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SF90 wrote on Oct 11th, 2018 at 6:06pm:
i_e wrote on Oct 11th, 2018 at 5:50pm:
In Aussie the have the Sporting Shooters Assn. , And being a member is one of the legitimate reasons for firearms ownership. This was done after the gun buy back and at the time caused much angst amongst weapons owners that you had to join or get a letter from a property owners as your legitimate reason ...

What it ended up creating was a monster political lobby group with 190,000 members and over $20 000 000.00 in earnings each year !! When push comes to shove they have a lot of power and certainty win consesions from government and keep the anti gun lobby( eg Greens) accountable for there constant misinformation campaign !!


Bugger me - that almost sounds like a plan ................

Just gotta get 'gonehuntin' on board now - shouldn't be hard† Roll Eyes



righto follow aussie with their gun laws and ill agree to a sporting shooters group.   Cheesy   never liked semis, and a stand down period buying guns would stop me leaving the hunting shop with a new rifle when I only went in for ammo  Grin
  
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #256 - Oct 11th, 2018 at 7:39pm
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Never said anything about copying the Australian laws Gonehunting I was just pointing out how an unpopular side effect of those laws produced an unexpectedly great outcome . Iím sure had the powers at be known what they were creating with making shooters join this assn., they would have done it differently !

Itís a very strong group and every time either the Greens or there little socialist buddyís at the Coalition for Gun Control come out with misleading statements they get ( very publicly) shot down in flames ..

This organization represents all shooters ( hunters and target ) and fights the battles that need attention at that time .. whether that be hunting restrictions or the banning of certain types of pistols etc
  

alcohol doesn't agree with me , but i sure do enjoy the argument!
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #257 - Oct 11th, 2018 at 9:22pm
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i_e wrote on Oct 11th, 2018 at 7:39pm:
Never said anything about copying the Australian laws Gonehunting I was just pointing out how an unpopular side effect of those laws produced an unexpectedly great outcome . Iím sure had the powers at be known what they were creating with making shooters join this assn., they would have done it differently !

Itís a very strong group and every time either the Greens or there little socialist buddyís at the Coalition for Gun Control come out with misleading statements they get ( very publicly) shot down in flames ..

This organization represents all shooters ( hunters and target ) and fights the battles that need attention at that time .. whether that be hunting restrictions or the banning of certain types of pistols etc


I think this is where the NZDA loses out in the actual name of the organization. A lot of people probably think it's just for hunters. Something like COLFO probably covers all firearms owners better but then not as interested in animal/herd management.

And then there's the side saying we should all support GAC but they seem to be controlled by the minister so any financial contribution is just paying the government to shaft us.
Please correct me if I'm wrong. Maybe I'm just confused about how it works.
  

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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #258 - Oct 11th, 2018 at 9:55pm
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XRhunter wrote on Oct 11th, 2018 at 11:35am:
Bear in mind how the minutia of DoC's internal workings are stacked against Hunters. Even if a political party that was pro hunters won the next election the pro hunter Minister of Conservation† would be stymied at every turn by the senior layer of career conversationalists (my spelling Roll Eyes) that inhabit the dark reaches of that organisation. As far back as its inception (1987) they have worked hard to ensure their ultimate goal is pre human inhabitation for as much of the conservation estate as they can muster. They even managed to have the original name for the department changed, from Ministry of Conservation and Recreation, to just Conservation. They wanted to be beholden to no one.
Now legislation has made a rod for their own back just a wee bit, but make no mistake, if they managed to get hold of Hunter provided funds, they would re-purpose them in a heartbeat.
A cleanout of the career rank and file would be of assistance, but more importantly would be some way to leverage changes in legislation. And Councils and other such hunter representations will not be able to manage that. For that to occur you need a political party heavily on your side Cool

Thats how we at the Outdoors party see it...we will look to completely change the culture at doc..the place needs a good gutting...
  

Co-leader NZ Outdoors Party http://www.outdoorsparty.co.nz
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #259 - Oct 11th, 2018 at 10:29pm
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Yes
  

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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #260 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 8:11am
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Rumpy wrote on Oct 11th, 2018 at 9:22pm:
I think this is where the NZDA loses out in the actual name of the organization. A lot of people probably think it's just for hunters. Something like COLFO probably covers all firearms owners better but then not as interested in animal/herd management.

I agree, also I belong to 2 other national organisations and the NZDA fee of $100 is going to put some off, there is an associate member fee but no explanation of what this is. Very confusing web site NZDA. An organisation is essential but is it NZDA? At the moment my money is with Tahr group until someone or some organisation steps up.
  
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #261 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 8:26am
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There are problems to be wary of with old, new or proposed groups. Any specific political alignment will alienate a percentage of potential members.
Policies that forbid members from proffessional meat hunting will lock out some. The NZDA policy of supporting the use of 1080 poison will deter many. There are two distinct issues ; one being the right to own firearms, whether for recreational hunting or other shooting (target) sports; the other for establishing and protecting game herds as managed assets. In amongst this are sport /local specific groups such as NRA and NZCTA, LNIRDf, SIKA foundation etc, Wapiti and Tahr foundations. Each of these have specific statements of purpose and rules. Then there are the several "conservation" groups, Forest and Bird being the most extreme example.
I don't know the constitution and rules of SSANZ, but the name alone sounds like a possible coalition start point to me, and lets face it, a formal coalition may be the sensible way forward.
  

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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #262 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 5:12pm
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Ssanz? Whatís that.?
  
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #263 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 6:25pm
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Apple wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 5:12pm:
Ssanz? Whatís that.?


Sporting Shooters Association New Zealand ??
  

alcohol doesn't agree with me , but i sure do enjoy the argument!
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #264 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 7:57pm
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Yes. Although there is another registeredorganisation with hunters, trappers and conservation values all within it's  constitution.  I definitely feel a strong coalition of groups is the way to get a fearsomely strong lobby that gov't could not play silly buggers against. Each group would support the core group financially and with necessary information, and an exec of each group would be part of the exec of the core group. Thus all participating groups interests would be represented, and the agreed common aims would become focal objectives. The structure would in itself provide a sustained working fund and would have no controls by government other than the rules governing companies or societies. Such a structure would not prevent the member groups from continuing to advocate their own objectives independently either.
  

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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #265 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 8:40pm
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huntnfish wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 7:57pm:
Yes. Although there is another registeredorganisation with hunters, trappers and conservation values all within it's† constitution.† I definitely feel a strong coalition of groups is the way to get a fearsomely strong lobby that gov't could not play silly buggers against. Each group would support the core group financially and with necessary information, and an exec of each group would be part of the exec of the core group. Thus all participating groups interests would be represented, and the agreed common aims would become focal objectives. The structure would in itself provide a sustained working fund and would have no controls by government other than the rules governing companies or societies. Such a structure would not prevent the member groups from continuing to advocate their own objectives independently either.


In short, everyone needs to work together, or as one.

Age old saying, together we stand divided we fall.!
  
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #266 - Oct 12th, 2018 at 9:11pm
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Apple wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 8:40pm:
huntnfish wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 7:57pm:
Yes. Although there is another registeredorganisation with hunters, trappers and conservation values all within it's† constitution.† I definitely feel a strong coalition of groups is the way to get a fearsomely strong lobby that gov't could not play silly buggers against. Each group would support the core group financially and with necessary information, and an exec of each group would be part of the exec of the core group. Thus all participating groups interests would be represented, and the agreed common aims would become focal objectives. The structure would in itself provide a sustained working fund and would have no controls by government other than the rules governing companies or societies. Such a structure would not prevent the member groups from continuing to advocate their own objectives independently either.


In short, everyone needs to work together, or as one.

Age old saying, together we stand divided we fall.!


You hit the nail on the head right there mate.

I don't know what groups are out there nor what membership they can call on, but for me it's the NZDA because they are already involved - and have a history of doing so.
Growing their numbers will give them more authority - a bigger voice.

I like what 'huntnfish' says too - a strong coalition of groups supporting a core group.

Our hunting is under threat like never before and I strongly believe that everyone who cares about such things should voluntarily join a group of their choice before your options are taken away from you.

  
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #267 - Oct 13th, 2018 at 5:26am
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start at the top with the gac, then filter down to fwf, managing wapiti, thar interest group managing thar, nzda managing red, fallow and white tail deer. then you have to find a place for waro, hunting guides,1080,possums,goats,pigs,sambar and rusa, then the worst bit trying to get all hunters to agree.
  
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #268 - Oct 13th, 2018 at 7:23am
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Its a shame so few understand the positive role of a well supported and funded GAC.

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2013/0098/latest/DLM4105024.html
  

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.......
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Re: Tahr eradication proposed by the minister
Reply #269 - Oct 13th, 2018 at 7:29am
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SF90 wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 9:11pm:
Apple wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 8:40pm:
huntnfish wrote on Oct 12th, 2018 at 7:57pm:
Yes. Although there is another registeredorganisation with hunters, trappers and conservation values all within it's† constitution.† I definitely feel a strong coalition of groups is the way to get a fearsomely strong lobby that gov't could not play silly buggers against. Each group would support the core group financially and with necessary information, and an exec of each group would be part of the exec of the core group. Thus all participating groups interests would be represented, and the agreed common aims would become focal objectives. The structure would in itself provide a sustained working fund and would have no controls by government other than the rules governing companies or societies. Such a structure would not prevent the member groups from continuing to advocate their own objectives independently either.


In short, everyone needs to work together, or as one.

Age old saying, together we stand divided we fall.!


You hit the nail on the head right there mate.

I don't know what groups are out there nor what membership they can call on, but for me it's the NZDA because they are already involved - and have a history of doing so.
Growing their numbers will give them more authority - a bigger voice.

I like what 'huntnfish' says too - a strong coalition of groups supporting a core group.

Our hunting is under threat like never before and I strongly believe that everyone who cares about such things should voluntarily join a group of their choice before your options are taken away from you.



A few years ago tahr numbers were reported as being 1000 to 1500 animals left after WARO had a good crack at them.
  
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