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Very Hot Topic (More than 100 Replies) Orange Fronted Kakariki (Read 4555 times)
Salmoner
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #15 - Jul 10th, 2018 at 10:35pm
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Salmoner wrote on Jul 7th, 2018 at 7:06pm:
Marty Foote wrote on Jul 7th, 2018 at 3:11am:
I'm just pricking DOC into getting back to the talking table.

The Orange-fronted DOC attachments are not publicly available and you will have to ask DOC if you want a copy..As such, I do not have the ability, to provide forum readers with the attachments, unless the forum owners will put in place a mechanism that will allow for such information transfer to happen.

However, I dear say, that if you made the same inquiries, that I did, you will receive the same information I did.

Hi RNZ people,

Please look at the attached Orange-fronted parakeet recovery documents, that I received after writing the stuff below, before you make any decisions about what you will do, as RNZ news reporters and RNZ journalists. You will see, in those attached documents, that DOC employees and DOC scientists have always been promoting trapping as something that needs to happen even where aerial 1080 is being used.

Please look at all the information and make your own decision on what you are prepared to do to promote in your own roles as RNZ reporters and/or RNZ celebrity personalities. I sincerely hope that the words like "unhinged" and "anti-1080 nutter" will never be a part of the sort of wording that RNZ people will ever use, in the future, when describing intelligent bushmen that are prepared to sign output contracts that mean that they will never get paid unless they achieve the predetermined wild animal control densities targeted.

Also...Please ensure that your new RNZ personality, Karen Hay, that doesn't have a current RNZ email address, is forwarded this email.

Before you analyse the information about orange-fronted kakariki...Be warned that the Orange-fronted parakeets are, quite simply, the "canary-in-the-coalmine" with regards to the way DOC is using aerial 1080. Look at other birds that have better public profiles (kiwi, whio, kea, etc) who are also being hurt by the total public reporting emphasis on aerial 1080 poison and absolutely no public reporting on the trapping contractors that support the aerial 1080 operations with the on-the-ground trapping work that is happening.

This is taken out of a larger document I'm working through looking at 1080 costs and effectiveness.

You will notice that at the same time DOC has been dropping 1080 to "save" the Orange-fronted parakeet, the bird numbers have actually plummeted, from a small, but viable, breeding population, to numbers so low that they cannot be encountered during the monitoring.

You will also notice that DOC started monitoring rats only until the results showed that 1080 was not killing the rats, DOC then switched to possum monitoring, for one year, during which the 1080 failed to kill possums and then DOC switched back to rat monitoring and placed the monitoring lines in places that they should not have been placed which then enabled them to pick and choose which monitor line results they would use in the EPA report.

Cheers...Marty

10) Hawdon, Andrews and Poulter valleys 2016.† †20,946† ha

EPA operational report: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Bait: $248,835.00† †= $11.88/ha at a sowing rate of† 2 + 2 = 4kg/ha = $2.97/kg bait cost.

Flying: $209,920.45† †= $10.02/ha = $2.51/kg

Transport/Storage: No costs recorded.

Security: $3,332.00 = $0.72/ha

Monitoring:
Stoat:No costs recorded
Rat:† No costs recorded
Possum: No costs recorded
No bait or carcass decay monitoring costs are recorded.

Management/Consultation: $45,012.00 = $2.15/ha

Consents: No costs recorded.

Post operation work (track clearance, buffer carcass removal, etc): No costs recorded.

Signage: $12,153.00 = $0.58/ha

Other: $1,567.00 + $3,124.00 = $4,691= $0.22/ha

Monitoring:

STOATS: No monitoring done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of stoat control for this operation.

POSSUMS: No monitoring done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum control for this operation.

RATS:

The post operation rat target was 5%.

Pre: Hawdon 4.7%, Poulter 0%
Post: Hawdon 0%, Poulter 0%

The operational area was below the rat target before the 1080 was applied.
There was no reason to proceed with the operation as the rat numbers were already below the target set.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control for this operation, except to say that the money spent here was wasted and would have been better spent somewhere else that had rat populations above the target set.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target:† "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon & Poulter Valleys at the conclusion of the 2016 / 2017 breeding season."

Outcome result: "No OFP's have been found in these valleys this season. There may be one OFP nest yet to be confirmed."

Historical 1080 operations for this area are linked below:

This operational area has had eight aerial 1080 operations over the last nine years, The Orange-fronted parakeet monitoring showed 13 nesting pairs in 2011 and today no Orange-fronted parakeets are being encountered. This means that there was a viable breeding population before 1080 was used and over the decade of 1080 use the Orange-fronted parakeet population has dropped to the point that no individual birds are being encountered during monitoring.

2008: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre: May-10%, June-7%, July-4%, Aug-11%, Sept-6%,
Post: Oct-0%, Nov-0%, Jan-0%, Mar-1.3%

This rat density monitoring pattern is normal, without rat control, with measured densities rising until Sept-Oct, dropping in Oct-Nov and starting to rise again in Mar-April.
The rat numbers never reached the level that could be described as "a plague of biblical proportions".
The 0% recorded in Nov/Jan cannot be definitely attributed to a 1080 rat kill and could very easily be the result of the rats moving into the canopy to feed.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control.

Possum: No possum monitoring was done.
Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum and stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target: No target set.

Outcome result: No monitoring completed.

2009: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre:† Jan-2%, Feb-0.9%, Mar-3.1%, Apr-7.5%, May-5.6%, Jun-8.5%, Jul-9.3%, Aug-22.7%.
Post:† Oct-1.5%, Nov-0%, Jan-0%.

This rat density monitoring pattern is normal, without rat control, with measured densities rising until Sept-Oct, dropping in Oct-Nov and starting to rise again in Mar-April.
The rat numbers never reached the level that could be described as "a plague of biblical proportions".
The low rat densities recorded in Oct/Nov/Jan cannot be definitely attributed to a 1080 rat kill and could very easily be the result of the rats moving into the canopy to feed.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control.

Possum: No possum monitoring was done.
Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum and stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target: "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon Valley at the conclusion of the 2009/10 breeding season. Orange-fronted parakeet encounter rates in the Hawdon Valley (from standardised monitoring lines) will not reduce from 2008/09 to 2009/10."

Outcome result: "OFP encounter rate in November 2009 was 0.38 birds per hour, compared with 0.21 birds per hour in the same survey in 2008."

2012: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre: Aug/Sept/Oct- up to 7% (Please note that the highest recorded line is 7% and there is no average stated)
Post: Dec to Mar-0%.

This rat density monitoring pattern is normal, without rat control, with measured densities rising until Sept-Oct, dropping in Oct-Nov and starting to rise again in Mar-April.
The rat numbers never reached the level that could be described as "a plague of biblical proportions" with the highest recorded line being 7%.
The low rat densities recorded in Dec to Mar cannot be definitely attributed to a 1080 rat kill and could very easily be the result of the rats moving into the canopy to feed.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control.

Possum: No possum monitoring was done.
Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum and stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target: "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon Valley at the conclusion of the 2012 / 2013 breeding season. Orangefronted parakeet encounter rates in the Hawdon Valley (from standardised monitoring lines) will not reduce from 2011/12 to 2012/13."

Outcome result: "The orange-fronted parakeet population is present in both the Poulter and Hawdon valleys however the number of orange-fronted parakeets in the Hawdon and Poulter is not known and it can not yet be determined whether the populations are still in decline, are stable or are increasing. Encounter rates and nests found were down from 13 nests in 2011/2012 to 5 in 2012/2013."

2013: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre: No monitoring done.
Post: No monitoring done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control.

Possum:
Pre: 70%BMI or 17.5%RTC & 31%BMI or 7.75%RTC (dividing the BMI by 4 to achieve RTC).
Post: 9%BMI or 2.25%RTC† & 10%BMI or 2.5%RTC (dividing the BMI by 4 to achieve RTC).

The post possum density was more than twice the target of 1%RTC.

Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target: "All known orange-fronted parakeet nests are fully protected against introduced predators."

Outcome result: "No monitoring of outcomes was undertaken."†

2014: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre: 26%
Post: 16%

The post rat density was more than 3 times the target of 5%.

Possum:
Pre: No monitoring done
Post: No Monitoring done

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum control.

Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target: "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon & Poulter Valleys at the conclusion of the 2014 / 2015 breeding season. Orange-fronted parakeet encounter rate will not decline."

Outcome result: "Monitoring ongoing."† (Please note, this is the second year running that Orange-fronted parakeet monitoring results have not been published).


2015: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre: 9%, 13%, 9%
Post: 0%, 0%, 0%

Because of poor placement of monitor lines the results cannot be relied upon to give accurate results.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control.

Possum:
Pre: No monitoring done
Post: No Monitoring done

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum control.

Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target:
1) "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon & Poulter Valleys at the conclusion of the 2014 / 2015 breeding season. Orange-fronted parakeet encounter rates in the Poulter will not decline."

2) "A viable orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the South Branch Hurunui at the conclusion of the 2014 / 2015 breeding season. Orange fronted parakeet encounter rate will not decline."

3) "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon & Poulter Valleys at the conclusion of the 2014 / 2015 breeding season. Orangefronted parakeet encounter rates in the Poulter will not decline."

Outcome result: "Encounter rate has not declined significantly since last season despite the massive beech mast and consequent influx of mice, rats and stoats.."† (Please note, this is the third year running that Orange-fronted parakeet monitoring results have not been published).

The wording of the Orange-fronted parakeet outcome result would indicate that the parakeet numbers are declining, although this decline is not as significant as the decline in 2012-13.

2016: https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

Rat:
Pre: 4.7%, 0%.
Post: 0%, 0%,

The rat density was recorded at below the target of 5% before the 1080 was applied.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of rat control.

Possum:
Pre: No monitoring done
Post: No Monitoring done

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of possum control.

Stoat: No stoat monitoring was done.

No claims can be made as to the effectiveness of stoat control.

Orange Fronted Parakeet:

Outcome target: "A viable breeding Orange-fronted parakeet population will still be present in the Hawdon & Poulter Valleys at the conclusion of the 2016 / 2017 breeding season."

Outcome result: "No OFP's have been found in these valleys this season. There may be one OFP nest yet to be confirmed.

Over the last decade the Orange-fronted parakeet population has declined from a small, but viable, breeding population to numbers so low that normal monitoring methods are unable to count any individual birds. At the same time as the decline has been happening there has been very intensive aerial 1080 operations happening that were supposed to "save" the Orange-fronted parakeets from extinction.


Are you saying that the Hawdon , Andrews Poulter and South Branch of the Hurunui have each had 1080 applications in 8 of last 9 years ?


Reply ?
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #16 - Jul 11th, 2018 at 6:51am
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I replied to your request for comment about the ZIP propaganda in posts #11 & #12.

I have copied my comments (post #49 of the Stewart Island thread) below about the way DOC has used Orange-fronted parakeet monitoring reports in a way that was designed to deceive the NZ Public about the known decline of OFP that was happening at the same time as aerial 1080 operations were taking place.

"Tell me then TH....Why the EPA reports I quoted from show a deliberate attempt to distract the NZ Public from the fact that the aerial 1080 programme was not "saving" Orange-fronted parakeet.

For 3-4 years DOC recorded that there "was no substantial decline in the OFP numbers". It was only in the last year reported that it became obvious that DOC had not been able to find any OFP for a number of years.

The DOC reported statement, about no substantial decline on OFP, was correct, except DOC failed to report that there can be no decline, what-so-ever, substantial or not, if the population was already at zero.

DOC was even dropping 1080 over rat populations that were less than 5%, when the target was 5%, and then DOC claimed that the 1080 control was successful because the post-1080 result was below the target of 5%.

See what I mean?....DOC paints a mental picture that they know is not true and when someone comes up with some well thought out alternative thoughts, backed up with facts created by DOC monitoring results, DOC does, what you are doing, and ridicules the messenger and starts painting another false picture to be consumed by the naive and unwary."
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #17 - Jul 11th, 2018 at 8:35am
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The question was... Were each of those operational areas Hawdon, Andrews , Poulter and south branch of the Hurunui have they each had aerial applications of 1080 in 8 of the last 9 years. Yes or no will suffice.
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #18 - Jul 11th, 2018 at 9:03am
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Yes the Sth Branch has been done at least 2 times in the last 6 years.
Iím not against 1080 itís just used too much now and itís not doing the job well enough to save the birds
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #19 - Jul 11th, 2018 at 9:42am
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Salmoner wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 8:35am:
The question was... Were each of those operational areas Hawdon, Andrews , Poulter and south branch of the Hurunui have they each had aerial applications of 1080 in 8 of the last 9 years. Yes or no will suffice.


In 2015 & 2016 EPA started recording the number of proposed 1080 operations as well as the number of reported operations. Prior to 2015 EPA had only recorded the number of reported operations and made no mention of proposed operations.

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

2015....56 proposed operations and 45 reported operations.

2016....60 proposed operations and 36 reported operations.

Nobody can be sure how many operations have taken place because not all the operations are being reported to the public through the EPA reports.
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #20 - Jul 11th, 2018 at 7:39pm
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It's called: "shooting DoC with a ball of their own shit"  Roll Eyes
  

If you don't know it all, then you don't know what you don't know.
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #21 - Jul 12th, 2018 at 7:23pm
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Marty Foote wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 9:42am:
Salmoner wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 8:35am:
The question was... Were each of those operational areas Hawdon, Andrews , Poulter and south branch of the Hurunui have they each had aerial applications of 1080 in 8 of the last 9 years. Yes or no will suffice.


In 2015 & 2016 EPA started recording the number of proposed 1080 operations as well as the number of reported operations. Prior to 2015 EPA had only recorded the number of reported operations and made no mention of proposed operations.

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

2015....56 proposed operations and 45 reported operations.

2016....60 proposed operations and 36 reported operations.

Nobody can be sure how many operations have taken place because not all the operations are being reported to the public through the EPA reports.


Yet you wrote this and i quote "this operational area has had eight aerial 1080 operations in the last nine years "

Why did you write that when you dont know ?


  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #22 - Jul 12th, 2018 at 10:26pm
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Salmoner wrote on Jul 12th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Marty Foote wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 9:42am:
Salmoner wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 8:35am:
The question was... Were each of those operational areas Hawdon, Andrews , Poulter and south branch of the Hurunui have they each had aerial applications of 1080 in 8 of the last 9 years. Yes or no will suffice.


In 2015 & 2016 EPA started recording the number of proposed 1080 operations as well as the number of reported operations. Prior to 2015 EPA had only recorded the number of reported operations and made no mention of proposed operations.

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

2015....56 proposed operations and 45 reported operations.

2016....60 proposed operations and 36 reported operations.

Nobody can be sure how many operations have taken place because not all the operations are being reported to the public through the EPA reports.


Yet you wrote this and i quote "this operational area has had eight aerial 1080 operations in the last nine years "

Why did you write that when you dont know ?


I could have added the words "that we know about as the aerial 1080 industry isn't reporting all the 1080 operations to the EPA or the NZ Public"

However, it is DOC's legal responsibility to honestly report as per the legislation and the requirements set down by the PCE. It should not be the NZ Public's responsibility to point out that DOC is not obeying the rules as well as reporting untruthfully when they do report.

Anyone that endorses DOC's, OSPRI's and Regional Councils failure to comply with the rules, regulations and laws, set down in the legislation, is actually endorsing the breakdown of law and order to the extent that the NZ Government is alienating many NZ Citizens from being protected by the laws that are not being obeyed.

Are you endorsing DOC's failure to comply with the rules, regulations and laws?
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #23 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 8:23am
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Marty Foote wrote on Jul 12th, 2018 at 10:26pm:
Salmoner wrote on Jul 12th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Marty Foote wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 9:42am:
Salmoner wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 8:35am:
The question was... Were each of those operational areas Hawdon, Andrews , Poulter and south branch of the Hurunui have they each had aerial applications of 1080 in 8 of the last 9 years. Yes or no will suffice.


In 2015 & 2016 EPA started recording the number of proposed 1080 operations as well as the number of reported operations. Prior to 2015 EPA had only recorded the number of reported operations and made no mention of proposed operations.

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

2015....56 proposed operations and 45 reported operations.

2016....60 proposed operations and 36 reported operations.

Nobody can be sure how many operations have taken place because not all the operations are being reported to the public through the EPA reports.


Yet you wrote this and i quote "this operational area has had eight aerial 1080 operations in the last nine years "

Why did you write that when you dont know ?


I could have added the words "that we know about as the aerial 1080 industry isn't reporting all the 1080 operations to the EPA or the NZ Public"

However, it is DOC's legal responsibility to honestly report as per the legislation and the requirements set down by the PCE. It should not be the NZ Public's responsibility to point out that DOC is not obeying the rules as well as reporting untruthfully when they do report.

Anyone that endorses DOC's, OSPRI's and Regional Councils failure to comply with the rules, regulations and laws, set down in the legislation, is actually endorsing the breakdown of law and order to the extent that the NZ Government is alienating many NZ Citizens from being protected by the laws that are not being obeyed.

Are you endorsing DOC's failure to comply with the rules, regulations and laws?


"Honestly report" are your words. Putting it simply you lambaste DOC for not providing correct figures and here you are MAKING UP FIGURES to support your claims.


  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #24 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 9:02am
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Salmoner wrote on Jul 13th, 2018 at 8:23am:
Marty Foote wrote on Jul 12th, 2018 at 10:26pm:
Salmoner wrote on Jul 12th, 2018 at 7:23pm:
Marty Foote wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 9:42am:
Salmoner wrote on Jul 11th, 2018 at 8:35am:
The question was... Were each of those operational areas Hawdon, Andrews , Poulter and south branch of the Hurunui have they each had aerial applications of 1080 in 8 of the last 9 years. Yes or no will suffice.


In 2015 & 2016 EPA started recording the number of proposed 1080 operations as well as the number of reported operations. Prior to 2015 EPA had only recorded the number of reported operations and made no mention of proposed operations.

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

https://www.epa.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/Documents/Hazardous-Substances/1080-repor...

2015....56 proposed operations and 45 reported operations.

2016....60 proposed operations and 36 reported operations.

Nobody can be sure how many operations have taken place because not all the operations are being reported to the public through the EPA reports.


Yet you wrote this and i quote "this operational area has had eight aerial 1080 operations in the last nine years "

Why did you write that when you dont know ?


I could have added the words "that we know about as the aerial 1080 industry isn't reporting all the 1080 operations to the EPA or the NZ Public"

However, it is DOC's legal responsibility to honestly report as per the legislation and the requirements set down by the PCE. It should not be the NZ Public's responsibility to point out that DOC is not obeying the rules as well as reporting untruthfully when they do report.

Anyone that endorses DOC's, OSPRI's and Regional Councils failure to comply with the rules, regulations and laws, set down in the legislation, is actually endorsing the breakdown of law and order to the extent that the NZ Government is alienating many NZ Citizens from being protected by the laws that are not being obeyed.

Are you endorsing DOC's failure to comply with the rules, regulations and laws?


"Honestly report" are your words. Putting it simply you lambaste DOC for not providing correct figures and here you are MAKING UP FIGURES to support your claims.




SO, you DO endorse DOC failing to obey rules, regulations and laws.

"Honestly reporting" is what EPA, PCE, MOH, RMA, etc all require DOC to do.

You obviously believe that the level of dishonesty, in the EPA 1080 reports, is acceptable, presumably, because it allows 1080 to be used without the sort of public scrutiny that the rules, regulations and laws are designed to achieve.

I have linked government reports to back my figures, the figures are not figments of my imagination. Where are your figures that are backed by documented evidence?
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #25 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 9:57am
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You provided the figures of how many operations there were... then you said no one can be sure of how many operations there were, which is it ?  ...

Please dont tell me what i endorse or believe in.

  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #26 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 12:02pm
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Salmoner wrote on Jul 13th, 2018 at 9:57am:
You provided the figures of how many operations there were... then you said no one can be sure of how many operations there were, which is it ?† ...

Please dont tell me what i endorse or believe in.



I provided figures, backed by DOC supplied EPA reports, and made the statement that not all 1080 operations have been reported to EPA, and I supplied EPA generated reports to show this is happening.

Also, in the DOC reports supplied to EPA, the OFP reporting was deliberately deceptive and DOC was indicating that there were OFP present, over a period of 3-4 years, when DOC could not find any OFP during their regular annual OFP monitoring. During this period DOC was dropping 1080 over a rat population that below the target and then claiming that 1080 had been effective because the post-1080 rat density was below the target.

Do you agree that this type of reporting is dishonest? If so, do you endorse this sort of dishonest reporting?
  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #27 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 12:43pm
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This discussion has absolutely nothing to do with what i think.

The discussion is about someone [you] putting up "facts" that suited your position. When you were challanged on those "facts" we got a complete reversal and then we get a whole heap of bluster, diversion and blaming someone else.




  
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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #28 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 12:59pm
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Salmoner wrote on Jul 13th, 2018 at 12:43pm:
This discussion has absolutely nothing to do with what i think.

The discussion is about someone [you] putting up "facts" that suited your position. When you were challanged on those "facts" we got a complete reversal and then we get a whole heap of bluster, diversion and blaming someone else.


You have told us what you think about me and my beliefs. That's OK by me...You are fully entitled to an opinion about what you think of me and my beliefs.

I note that you have not told us your opinion on the dishonest reporting by DOC.

You are wrong about opinions, as DOC has created an environment where the only thing that matters is the strength of opposing opinions with DOC feeding 1080 supporters with false reports about the effectiveness of 1080 to kill the animals they are targeting for control as well as the benefits being attributed to native wildlife.

Good quality opinions cannot be formed when people are supplied with sub-standard information. Good quality opinions can only be formed when all the information is presented in a clear, accessible and honest way.
  
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I love salmon fishin

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Re: Orange Fronted Kakariki
Reply #29 - Jul 13th, 2018 at 5:23pm
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That doesnt deserve a response.
  
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