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Normal Topic Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet. (Read 2664 times)
Brett Milson
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Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
May 9th, 2018 at 12:49pm
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So I have had a bit of a trawl through the threads and cant really find any info regarding this situation. I have a 3 year old Beagle who has free reign around the house and while disciplined is no where near the required discipline for a hunting dog (inquisitive snout!)
I would like to get hold of a hunting dog, probably a lab and my question is: has anyone else managed to train a decent Deer dog whilst its living on the same property as a pet dog?
If so, what strategies did you put into place to ensure a well disciplined effective dog?
Thanks
  
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #1 - May 10th, 2018 at 2:02pm
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Brett

I don't have first hand experience in the situation described.  Anything is possible but you are making life harder than it needs to be in my view.

If I was you I would use the first dog to learn on and hone your skills, make all your mistakes there.  Pick up a hunting dog reap the benefits of your freshly acquired experience.

Don't take this the wrong way but what makes you think you will do a better job of the new dog?  Remember the second dog will most likely make the job harder. 

I see you're from Palmerston North.  If you are serious go an see Paul Hutton he is without doubt excellent.  Handled over 30,000 dogs. 


Cheers, Dan
  

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Brett Milson
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #2 - May 10th, 2018 at 3:40pm
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Thanks Dan. Good advice. Cheers
  
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trusty222
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #3 - May 12th, 2018 at 12:05pm
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training a dog when you already own another one is easy. even if your older dog as you say is "not that well behaved", even easier if you have a well trained dog (but is a little different from the approach I am recommending below, Ive had 8 dogs at home/well kenneled and trained pups with no issue)

the main thing is to eliminate any distraction in the beginning that may be caused  by your older dog, by this I mean do the training on your young/new dog in isolation from your older dog, eg, kennel the old dog and complete your training out of sight with your young dog under zero distraction at the start, once you feel the pup has things nailed down, and I mean 100% on there own under NO distraction increase distraction a little bit at a time.

when old and young dog are playing/running together, do NOT try and implement a command that you have no way of enforcing on either dog (eg IN, pup looks at old dog ignoring command , so pup ignores as well, this will only create issues that you will need to correct down the track)

Having another dog later in the training phase to act as a distraction (once you have the basics nailed down, stop, recall) will be an advantage and will also help you solidify good training of the basic foundations.

"dog training, get it right the 1st time and train for success"

by basics I would recommend working on

trusty222 wrote on Mar 18th, 2015 at 9:14pm:
some links for commands
http://www.fishnhunt.co.nz/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1351128930/24#24
http://www.fishnhunt.co.nz/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1361331064/

how our dogs are working
http://www.bcl.kiwi/videos/, hope to get a few more clips up soon, dogs are NEVER sent out to find a wounded or dead deer for its self, everything is done under control and full hunting condition scenario

I base a lot of my training around a bullet proof stop
http://www.fishnhunt.co.nz/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1350375282/30#30

I like to break the process down into small blocks or foundations, teaching the dogs these foundations in isolation and then put them together. Makes training very easy and is successful. I hope to do a set of articles from pup to going dog over the next little while.

base foundation training (some of the key foundations and in no particular order)
  • breed/pup selection
  • camp/house/kennel/chain manners
  • In/heal
  • a stop/sit
  • target specific training
  • getting a dog to utilise and wind and ground scent to find a target
  • firearms training
  • get on, teaching a dog to hunt in front within a given distance
  • getting the dog out on the hill and putting it into the right spots

Hot barrels


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DOG TRAINING "GET IT RIGHT THE 1ST TIME & TRAIN FOR SUCCESS"
WWW.BCL.KIWI
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #4 - May 12th, 2018 at 12:12pm
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"Technically" or perhaps better said theoretically, there should not be a problem. You leave the Beagle at home and you go out with the other dog to train it. 

If you have the beagle around while training your deer dog, it will only confuse matters.

Having two dogs is a bit more work, so you have to be absolutely committed to this before picking up a second dog. Getting one is the easier bit,, training it to the standard you want is where the work and perseverance starts, and it will require a better understanding of dogs than having a pet dog that as you say pretty much eats, sleeps, comes when called and not a lot else. 

So its really on you how well getting your second dog turns out. I think its good advice to do a bit more research and talk to someone who has heaps of experience as suggested, before you make a descision.  Smiley
  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #5 - May 12th, 2018 at 12:16pm
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Good post Trusty. We must have been writing at the same moment..  Smiley
  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #6 - May 12th, 2018 at 12:32pm
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headcase wrote on May 12th, 2018 at 12:16pm:
Good post Trusty. We must have been writing at the same moment..  Smiley


we're on the same wave length HC  Smiley

also worth a look "Brett Milson"
http://www.fishnhunt.co.nz/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1436175146/0


hot barrels
  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #7 - May 13th, 2018 at 11:25am
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trusty222 wrote on May 12th, 2018 at 12:32pm:
headcase wrote on May 12th, 2018 at 12:16pm:
Good post Trusty. We must have been writing at the same moment..  Smiley


we're on the same wave length HC  Smiley

also worth a look "Brett Milson"
http://www.fishnhunt.co.nz/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1436175146/0


hot barrels


The training separation will be key as Trusty and HC have point out.

My reasoning for starting with the Beagle will be the non-hunting handling i.e going down to the river etc. will become hard work with one dog that listens while the other doesn't.  Doable but again makes life harder than it needs to be.  Most people get sick of hard work and hassles.  Throw in family members that don't fully understand why you are doing different things with different dogs and again it's a hard life.    

More so than that it will be about proving to yourself that you are actually capable of doing training.  Not everyone is.  You will either end up with two good dogs or realise you aren't up to the task and give up.  Either is better than two poor dogs. 

Hard work up front will be repaid 10 fold down the track.


Cheers, Dan
  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #8 - May 14th, 2018 at 12:12pm
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Bang on Trusty and HC. Having a second less trained dog can actually make for a good training regime for your pup in the end. Once they are rock solid on their own and you introduce distractions slowly and incrementally. I have this exact scenario now with my wife's less trained (but nice natured) companion and my pup. Bottom line is exactly as Trusty outlines. I got my pup bang on on her own first and gradually added distraction. Now she has the house dog being looser on commands but she knows that a command given to her is meant and will be reinforced if she tries to take liberties. Like Trusty says, never issue a command you will not/ cannot reinforce. My pup now operates under really good command no matter what the distraction and part of the regime was enforcing commands to her even when around the house dog. It actually helped take her training to another level. I now put a stop on her in front of the dog kennels in the morning while I let the working dogs out and she doesn't budge until given the release command. Not bad for seven months old I reckon.  Wink
  
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #9 - May 14th, 2018 at 2:34pm
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Interesting.

I am just struggling with the day-to-day aspects of having one dog under control and one not so under control?


Cheers, Dan
  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #10 - May 14th, 2018 at 5:35pm
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The house dog is a piece of well loved furnature. It does what it wants anyway. Control is an illusion so leave it at home  Grin

Put all your focus on the other dog, whoes behaviour you are going to shape to your objectives. It will repond because you are giving it your focus, and dogs luvet. 

I now put a stop on her in front of the dog kennels in the morning while I let the working dogs out and she doesn't budge until given the release command.


Right there you have set the dog up for a good day, focused on you.
Lovely to read that.




  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #11 - May 15th, 2018 at 6:25am
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I'm with ya now HC.  Just a bit simple from time to time 😂
  

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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #12 - May 18th, 2018 at 11:27am
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Thanks a lot for all the information guys. There was some really good points in there for me to have a good look at. Time to research more and then make a decision. Needless to say I will heed a lot of the advice posted here.
Cheers Smiley
  
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #13 - May 21st, 2018 at 7:16pm
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All the best mate. Enjoy yourself. It is after all supposed to be fun. Wink
  
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Re: Training a Deer dog alongside a household pet.
Reply #14 - Jun 4th, 2018 at 9:49am
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I found having a well trained dog will help with training a new dog/pup, as it will do as the older dog does, so you will need to have your first dog good to go otherwise it’s bad habits will rub off either way you’ll get out of them what you put into them
  
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