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Very Hot Topic (More than 100 Replies) Molesworth 1080 (Read 12384 times)
XRhunter
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #210 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:09am
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headcase wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 7:15am:
Grazing leases were abandoned  by the holders in the 1940's

The rabbits got the better of the situation and made it their own? or something else?  Smiley

Just to clarify, thermal imagine will not solve Nzs pest problem. They are just another tool to reduce numbers.   I still use a few  ton  of Pindone every year  with the other tools and combined they only hold numbers in check. Just sayin.. untill a biological solution and total eradication of pesky critters we will be having this discussion for a long time..

Still support more deer repellent though. Deer numbers are easy to control from the air on land such as Molesworth, so they are not a problem. If theres too many , knock em back.  Its the small stuff that we dont see easily needs the lid kept on it with constant pressure.


Right on. Your #17 reply on the rabbits thread painted a vivid image in my mind of just how bad it can get... and in the 40's it was obviously magnitudes worse. Pity we can't just eat them into controllable numbers Cheesy  But yes, in country like Molesworth  access from the air does/should make getting on top of pests a tad easier than other areas.
As a farmer, I am well aware that a handful of slack arsed farmers do more damage to transmitting Btb than a significant number of areas with possums present.
Deer numbers in country like Molesworth will always be easy to manage, and as others have said, if numbers had got so high, why on earth couldn't all that meat be harvested prior to the green rain?????
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #211 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 12:59pm
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XRhunter wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 7:10am:
gonehuntin wrote on Dec 6th, 2017 at 5:09pm:
I think most of you here have forgotten 1 thing. molesworth is primarily a working station not a private trophy park, cattle and reducing tb are a far higher priority then a few scummy hunters yet once again a selfish hunters seem to think they have the right to dictate what should and shouldnt be used to protect crown owned deer.

not your deer, not your land, get over it most of nz dosent care and dosent really have a reason to. mayby find another reason apart from your own selfish ones to get repellents or 1080 banned and mayby the rest of us would care. youre all like a nagging wife so youre pushing shite uphill to get someone to listen let alone do some thing  Cheesy

Cattle and the stations bottomline are far more important then wild pest animals



A wee history lesson GH:

Molesworth has always been Crown land (i.e. owned by us, the public). Grazing leases were abandoned  by the holders in the 1940's  because Headcase and his thermal sight had not yet been invented. Since then its been run as a farm by LINZ, then LandCorp, who fought very hard to keep us excluded from the area till DoC  (and believe it or not a forest and bird influence) prevailed in the early 2000's, and had the entire area classified as Public Conservation Land. Doc kept LandCorp running most of the area as a farm (correct term Farm Park) to recognise the areas unique history, as well as the environmental outcomes running most of it as a farm gave. A key outcome was that recreational opportunities had to be ENHANCED.

So GH, it is our land, and they are our deer (in the broadest sense)  Smiley


If it was truly our land and our deer then why do you abide by someone elses rules?  why dont you spotlight it, build a house there? Hell just move on into a house or hut there.

you are foolish to think any doc/ public land belongs to us. ownership is the crown and admin by doc yours and my name are not on the title we have no right and no claim there. we are allowed to visit when they say we can otherwise youd technically be a tresspasser or poacher.

  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #212 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 1:10pm
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gonehuntin wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 12:59pm:
XRhunter wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 7:10am:
gonehuntin wrote on Dec 6th, 2017 at 5:09pm:
I think most of you here have forgotten 1 thing. molesworth is primarily a working station not a private trophy park, cattle and reducing tb are a far higher priority then a few scummy hunters yet once again a selfish hunters seem to think they have the right to dictate what should and shouldnt be used to protect crown owned deer.

not your deer, not your land, get over it most of nz dosent care and dosent really have a reason to. mayby find another reason apart from your own selfish ones to get repellents or 1080 banned and mayby the rest of us would care. youre all like a nagging wife so youre pushing shite uphill to get someone to listen let alone do some thing  Cheesy

Cattle and the stations bottomline are far more important then wild pest animals



A wee history lesson GH:

Molesworth has always been Crown land (i.e. owned by us, the public). Grazing leases were abandoned  by the holders in the 1940's  because Headcase and his thermal sight had not yet been invented. Since then its been run as a farm by LINZ, then LandCorp, who fought very hard to keep us excluded from the area till DoC  (and believe it or not a forest and bird influence) prevailed in the early 2000's, and had the entire area classified as Public Conservation Land. Doc kept LandCorp running most of the area as a farm (correct term Farm Park) to recognise the areas unique history, as well as the environmental outcomes running most of it as a farm gave. A key outcome was that recreational opportunities had to be ENHANCED.

So GH, it is our land, and they are our deer (in the broadest sense)  Smiley


If it was truly our land and our deer then why do you abide by someone elses rules?  why dont you spotlight it, build a house there? Hell just move on into a house or hut there.

you are foolish to think any doc/ public land belongs to us. ownership is the crown and admin by doc yours and my name are not on the title we have no right and no claim there. we are allowed to visit when they say we can otherwise youd technically be a tresspasser or poacher.



But what about the Magna Carter??!! I demand my rights...blah blah... Grin Grin
  

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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #213 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 1:43pm
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huntnfish wrote on Dec 6th, 2017 at 4:34pm:
TB infected possums were released on Muzzel Station which bounders Molesworth Station southern boundary along the Clarence.


I am sure most people will find that as sinister as there a supposed to be plenty of TB possums on Molesworth.
They always follow up a TB possum release with a 1080 drop.


Thats an interesting statement.
Any facts to back it up?
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #214 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 1:54pm
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Bos wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 1:43pm:
huntnfish wrote on Dec 6th, 2017 at 4:34pm:
TB infected possums were released on Muzzel Station which bounders Molesworth Station southern boundary along the Clarence.


I am sure most people will find that as sinister as there a supposed to be plenty of TB possums on Molesworth.
They always follow up a TB possum release with a 1080 drop.


Thats an interesting statement.
Any facts to back it up?


I stuck up the link to the full story: How does chronic TB affect possum movements?
  

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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #215 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 5:10pm
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Sorry, misunderstood
Thought the suggestion was that their had been an illegal release of infected possums on to the muzzle.
LC Research and Ivor Yockney also did a lot of work trapping and releasing feral pigs to monitor their movements as well.
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #216 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 5:35pm
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Oscar wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:03am:
madfish71 wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 7:43am:
TB will never get controlled in the near future while TBFREE has anything to do with it, the Gravy train must roll on.
Theres always going to some excuse that TB is around or the 1080 rain must continue to make sure that the TB doesnt start again in possums.


Grin Don't let the facts get in the way of a fantasy. TBFree's budget was reduced by 25% last year, $20m pa or thereabouts. Because of their success in controlling TB.

If only they realized the world-class knowledge on bTB eradication resided on this Forum though  Grin

Yeah, lets not let the facts get in the way of the fantasy that DOC and TBFREE feed to the masses.
TB has been proven has it not that stock movement is the main cause of invections rather than the possum DOC wanted us to believe for years.
1080 possum control for TB has been going on since the ages and they state it kills possums so good why wouldnt the budget be reduced because surly theres stuff all possums left in this country, little alone with TB and invecting herds of cows if 1080 worked.
DOC couldnt justify the extra use of 1080 so had to make up some BS about possum eating birds and rats of plagues like the world has never seen to carry on the gravy train.
They spilt it into DOC and TBFREE so others such as farmers can user pay and get the 1080 rain onto private land getting farmers on board.
Yes, we know whats fantasy and its the lies, the BS that DOC and their sub group TBFREE free the sheep
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #217 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 5:57pm
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Ive been a dairy farmer for 20 years so am definitely aware and pro the industry but I think that cattle spread tb among themselves more than the possums do to cattle. Wiping out every single possum will not stop tb in this country in mop. Once again I think its about money and the gravy train, not if its right or wrong to drop it. One excuse doc has used is they have to and only use it in inaccessible areas and dont drop it into waterways, well Clements Road proves that lie very wrong. And so much covering up and very weak public dialogue. But at the end of the day the pros and cons will argue their life away to no end because it will be dropped regardless for now as its not about rational.
  

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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #218 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:05pm
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Gonehuntin we took some young fellas in to shoot hares and rabbits so had to do all the nessesary permit paper work. I asked if we could put possums on the permit but were told no spotlighting. That's ok I said we will just set a few traps. Ahh no you can't do that either it will mess with our trapping counts etc etc. So it's not as easy as you might think to help reduce the numbers in there.
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #219 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:15pm
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Quote:
DOC couldnt justify the extra use of 1080 so had to make up some BS about possum eating birds


Here's a video of a possum raiding a birds nest

https://teara.govt.nz/en/video/16899/possum-eating-a-chick
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #220 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:59pm
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Backcountry Bob wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:15pm:
Quote:
DOC couldnt justify the extra use of 1080 so had to make up some BS about possum eating birds


Here's a video of a possum raiding a birds nest

https://teara.govt.nz/en/video/16899/possum-eating-a-chick

haha prob Took years to get that footage if not fake produced. Possums arent the bird eating monster just like theres not  plaques of rats the world hasnt seen wiping out the birds. Its the biggest load of bs out there the general public has been feed and many ate it like staving bloody sheep
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #221 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 9:23pm
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wow this one has really grown some legs.......
for the most part the dialog has been civil .....well done.

someone (at about page 12) suggested getting politition to feed green pellets to deer by hand......
Ive sugested this for years but do it to a large sample of different animals,cat/dog/sheep/cute fluffy bunny etc etc and video it right through then get it out in public eyes....... I first suggested this way back before the internet yet no one has been game to do it.

the powers that be CAN NOT procecute you for doing it if you licenced to use the stuff
the SPCA might be able to but that would backfire on govt agencies who want to use it in future
they cant have it both ways...either its ok to use it to kill animals or its not.

I dont like the stuff but can see its good points if used in very controlled manner eg flower pots (like we did with cynide in the 90s)

I dont agree with wholesale aerial dropping of any poison,we have history of common practices coming back to bite us in the bum year later in this country....
  
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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #222 - Dec 7th, 2017 at 9:54pm
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Save the possum then. They are cute.
  

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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #223 - Dec 8th, 2017 at 5:25am
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madfish71 wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:59pm:
Backcountry Bob wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:15pm:
Quote:
DOC couldnt justify the extra use of 1080 so had to make up some BS about possum eating birds


Here's a video of a possum raiding a birds nest

https://teara.govt.nz/en/video/16899/possum-eating-a-chick

haha prob Took years to get that footage if not fake produced. Possums arent the bird eating monster just like theres not  plaques of rats the world hasnt seen wiping out the birds. Its the biggest load of bs out there the general public has been feed and many ate it like staving bloody sheep


Of course. The vid was produced at Docywood. The 'possum was trained and the birds were animations. The threat letters were produced from the same studio.

The hundreds of thousands of rats caught in traps by private citizens are bred by DOC at a secret underground facility and released to perpetuate the "plague" myth.

At a secret lab gene technology has been developed to mute birds, so that hunters don't hear any bird song. This is because DOC scientists have made the amazing discovery that 1080 does not kill every single bird - there is some residual by-live - so they need to cover that off in case hunters think 1080 is ineffective.

This is all funded by the 1080 gravy train.
  

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Re: Molesworth 1080
Reply #224 - Dec 8th, 2017 at 7:28am
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madfish71 wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 5:35pm:
Oscar wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 8:03am:
madfish71 wrote on Dec 7th, 2017 at 7:43am:
TB will never get controlled in the near future while TBFREE has anything to do with it, the Gravy train must roll on.
[...]


Grin Don't let the facts get in the way of a fantasy. TBFree's budget was reduced by 25% last year, $20m pa or thereabouts. Because of their success in controlling TB.

If only they realized the world-class knowledge on bTB eradication resided on this Forum though  Grin


[...]

1080 possum control for TB has been going on since the ages and they state it kills possums so good why wouldnt the budget be reduced


Ha, in two posts you managed a complete 180, from 'the gravy train must roll on' to 'why wouldn't the budget be reducedSmiley  And it goes downhill from there  Smiley

This is a problem for 'hunters' collectively in NZ. The public reads those anti 1080 just declaring any conflicting information 'false', and it means collectively we have very little credibility. It makes DOC and TBFree's job easier, not harder. Look how easy it was to get media attention to that letter purportedly from 'hunters'.


  

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