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Hot Topic (More than 30 Replies) Growing Fallow buck trophies .... (Read 39788 times)
Grandad
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #15 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:00pm
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Jeez porkchop, you had me puzzled for about 3 minutes.  It's not me, I was trying to protect the bloke's privacy.
  

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PORKCHOP
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #16 - Jun 19th, 2011 at 2:55pm
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Oh. I didn't realise. Sorry  Smiley
  
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Grandad
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #17 - Apr 4th, 2012 at 9:17am
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Bump.  Leave those young bucks.
  

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PK33
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #18 - Apr 4th, 2012 at 8:23pm
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What are your thoughts on the wanganui herd Grandad? Most of the bucks are ok on one side but split palm on the other. Will they even up or get better with age? Most people say there is something lacking in the soil as I have heard very good blood has been brought in but dosnt seem to fix the split
Smiley
  
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Kersh
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #19 - Apr 4th, 2012 at 10:31pm
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Here's a couple of Stags from the Wangas Herd.
As Grandad suggested, Both were left alone.  Smiley
Both were never seen again.  Sad

Little Uneven, but gettin there.

Great Symetrical Head, Only even head I've seen in the Wanganui Wilds
(youtube may still be processing it)
  

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Grandad
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #20 - Apr 5th, 2012 at 8:59am
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PK33 wrote on Apr 4th, 2012 at 8:23pm:
What are your thoughts on the wanganui herd Grandad? Most of the bucks are ok on one side but split palm on the other. Will they even up or get better with age? Most people say there is something lacking in the soil as I have heard very good blood has been brought in but dosnt seem to fix the split
Smiley

There are no doubts on this situation.  Typical Wanganui mature head has split palms which has come about thru environmental deficiencies.  The deer liberated (from Burghley park, Surrey) were from a top gene pool, but were let go at Kaiwhaiki (sp?) right at the tail end of the sandstone country. The light sandstone belt runs from Waitotara valley south to Lismore.  Photos of the bucks shot when licences first issued, show that the clefts had appeared within three deer generations. Thirty years.
Today's situation is that the country up closer to Raetihi, which is mudstone country, produces better trophies.  And there was a deer farm well South on the Parapara country which had introduced some Hungarian? bucks, and then failed.  The deer were just abandoned.  A cluster of very good bucks were shot there last year. Full palms and DS ranging from 190 to 200 7/8.
Apart from that, the Wanganui mature bucks of today are cleft palm.  But that statement ignores the fact that two yr old and three yr old bucks normally have split palms anyway.  The splits fill in with age.   In fact I have two bucks walking around my paddock with 12 & 13 point split palm FIRST HEADS.  Just a result of superb tucker.
  I hope you've read the stuff I have in "The Fallow files" above. Part 4 covers the Rut.
  

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PK33
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #21 - Apr 5th, 2012 at 8:18pm
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Thanks for that Grandad. Yes I have read your write up Smiley
Interesting how the soil has such an effect on the heads. I have heard that the heads get better the further north you get.
I got a bloody good buck a few years ago that was within 20 minutes drive of wanganui. No split. He had 18 hinds with him  Shocked I guess I was just lucky  Smiley
  
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Grandad
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #22 - Feb 9th, 2013 at 9:57am
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In this thread I have commented on the "straight antlered buck".
It polishes at 3 1/4 yrs old, and has a noticeably narrow antlered head. The shape is influenced by immaturity, with it's small skull the pedicles are close together & upright. As the skull matures the pedicles change their angle & this gives the maturing trophy head the spread & skull which typifies the species. Hence the extra spread allowance that Norman Douglas allowed in his fallow scoring system.  I can now show a photo that I didn't have at the original post. It's my captive menil (note the prominent summer spots) buck. Age is guaranteed 'cause I've had it since spiker. The narrow span appears with all 3 yr old bucks. Obviously a mistake to shoot them. As a 4 yr old they get the spread/span.

  This batch of pics also gives me the chance to explain more about the dreaded split (cleft) palm. Pictured here by the same buck.  The feature is common in Wanganui herd bucks, where it is caused by the environment: light sandstone country.  The feature also appears tho in young bucks. Even in good herds like the Greenstone. But it disappears with the next year's antler growth. That's another reason not to shoot young bucks. This is just an average bloodline buck but it's on good tucker. The cleft palm is youth. Next year (lord willing) I'll show you a fully developed palm.

  And a final matter of interest: this next pic is not great but the best I could get. The two bucks (one Common, one Menil) are the same age, I got them both as spikers. And they came from a place that had only one buck, so they had the same dad.  If you zoom the pic in a bit, you'll see their antlers are absolutely identical. Features inherited from the same dad.  So if you're chasing a known trophy buck or stag, shoot him after the rut. So his features can be passed on. In Germany you wouldn't be allowed to shoot a trophy in the rut.

OK. Watch for my book, it should hit the shelves mid-year.
  

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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #23 - Feb 9th, 2013 at 10:02am
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beautiful young bucks mate! Cool
  
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #24 - Feb 9th, 2013 at 12:27pm
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chris wrote on Feb 9th, 2013 at 10:02am:
beautiful young bucks mate! Cool


+1, thanks for sharing Grandad! Smiley
  

….The hunter ordinarily has no gallery to applaude or disapprove of his conduct. Whatever his act, they are dictated by his own conscience, rather than by a mob of onlookers….
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #25 - Feb 11th, 2013 at 9:57pm
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I'll be up for a copy of your book cheers Grandad.
  
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #26 - Feb 12th, 2013 at 10:32pm
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Quote:
I'll be up for a copy of your book cheers Grandad.

+1 Please. Smiley
  

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Grandad
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #27 - Jan 23rd, 2014 at 2:39pm
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This time last year (Reply 22) I used pics of two bucks in my paddock,( then 3 yr olds, same genes same dad)  to illustrate two aspects of the developing fallow trophy:  antler spread, split palms.  It is good to be able to show you exactly what has happened since. Here are the pics taken today.
   Scroll up and look at the pic of the "straight antlered buck", a result of an immature 3 yr old skull with upright pedicles close together. Now here's a pic of the two bucks in an identical pose and you can see the spread has started to improve at 4 yrs old as the bone structure gets heavier and skull grows.  The spread will be even better next year but that will be about it for these bucks.


I spoke also about split palms, particularly the Wanganui herd,  and I said that  in all herds you will normally get split palms with the two yr and three year old bucks.  Many bucks are shot by the average hunter who thinks they are rubbish heads.   Not so, they are young bucks that in another two or three years would likely be wallhangers.  Now look at the pics of this buck,  first pic as a 2 yr old (and the 3 yr old had the same clefts but bigger antlers);  second pic this morning as a 4 yr old, he's growing a nice head.  Next year he'll be a trophy.


today:


The message is obvious guys and gals.
Grandad
  

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MikeB
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #28 - Jan 24th, 2014 at 1:00pm
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That is great to see those year by year photos. Excellent demonstration.

I find that it is all in the neck when estimating age. The older bucks really start to develop the big thick neck, thickset front and chest.

Easy to spot when standing near a younger animal.

Cheers Grandad, very good resource
  
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cleaky
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Re: Growing Fallow buck trophies ....
Reply #29 - Jan 24th, 2014 at 2:53pm
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What a difference, shows the benefit of leaving them a year or two.
  

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